CLAY: If you need a little pick me up, how about CNN getting body slammed over their covid coverage? Props to Joe Rogan, who had Dr. Sanjay Gupta on his podcast. Dr. Sanjay Gupta is the chief medical reporter, I guess it’s probably fair to call him, of the CNN network. He’s been on all the time ever since covid started.

And, to be fair, he actually asked, Buck, Dr. Fauci one of the few questions that Fauci’s actually had to be asked surrounding natural immunity. We played that for you… It’s probably been a month ago or so that that conversation between Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Dr. Fauci happened. But you’ll all recall, I think many of you, that Joe Rogan tested positive for covid, and he decided to take a cocktail of drugs to try to help him recover from covid.

And one of them was ivermectin which, Buck, you took when you had covid. And we talked about on this radio program how unfair the coverage from CNN was because they kept calling it a horse dewormer. And you talked about this back then, Buck. When you made the decision, you consulted with a physician, and he said, “Hey, you might as well basically try some of these therapeutics and see whether or not they help you recover while you’re dealing with covid.”

Because at the time when you had it, there was no covid vaccine and there was no prescribed, definitive treatment. And so Buck had it. And Joe Rogan also had it prescribed to him by a doctor. And CNN, for a week or more, ridiculed him across all of their shows for taking a horse deworming pill as if he had gone to a vet clinic and said, “Hey, give me the pills that you give a horse for deworming.” And the reality is, Buck, as you said on this show, tens of millions of people take ivermectin for years. In fact, somebody got the Nobel Prize for the amount of people that it’s helped.

BUCK: It has gotten rid of millions of cases of river blindness, which I think everybody from the name will know what can happen to you —

CLAY: Not ideal.

BUCK: — if you don’t have this anti-parasitic medicine, which is really what it is. And, Clay, I see this, and this is one of these moments where we have to understand how this influences everything we talk about when it comes to covid. Because this is the left, the apparatus of Fauciism, CNN as the DNC propaganda mouthpiece that it is, lying to people willfully and maliciously.

Because it was more fun to ridicule the other side than it was to just deal with the reality of the fact that there are still some MDs out there who think, by the way — they don’t say it cures it, they don’t even say they know how much. Some might say they feel very strongly, but no one’s saying this is a silver bullet or anything like that. It’s just because we didn’t have great therapeutics, it’s worth it to take a safe drug for humans.

CLAY: There’s no harm that can be done here.

BUCK: That was how my doctor put it to me. He goes, “There’s no downside here.” He said, “It’s not gonna hurt you, and it may help you, and there’s some reason to believe it may help you.” Given that that was the conversation and then they pretended that it was horse dewormer, this is just the limousine liberals over at CNN essentially spewing bile on the rest of the country. Anybody who doesn’t go along with Fauciism for the amusement of their audience at the expense of truth and science and honesty — and that’s what CNN is now. That’s who they are.

CLAY: Now, I want to give credit to Sanjay Gupta for going on Joe Rogan’s podcast because this is something that Dr. Fauci refused to do with us. For people out there who don’t know, we have, Buck and I, made official requests for Dr. Fauci, has time to do a documentary, he’s got time to do CNN and MSNBC multiple times a day. They basically have their own offices for him there.

We’ve got the biggest radio show in the country. And we went to him and said, “Hey, we’ll be fair. We’ll just want to ask you questions about covid outside of the protected sphere of CNN and MSNBC because, frankly, there are a lot of questions that are not being asked that rational, reasonable, nuanced people out there both in our audience and beyond, would like to hear answered.

So to Dr. Sanjay Gupta’s credit, he went on Joe Rogan’s podcast. Unfortunately, you saw how quickly — for him, unfortunately; fortunately for us. You saw how quickly the talking points can collapse when you don’t have Don Lemon sort of cradling you and holding you and saying, “Oh, you’re so amazing,” and so I want to you to listen to Joe Rogan as he grills down to Dr. Sanjay Gupta.

This is what happens when you get outside of the Anderson Cooper, of the Don Lemon, of the Jake Tapper on CNN, all of these guys — Brian Stelter — who were saying the horse dewormer. This is what happens when you actually go beyond the headline and ask some questions of a CNN medical expert. Listen to this.

ROGAN: Do you think that that’s a problem that your news network lies?

GUPTA: It was not… (sputtering) Well (muttering) I don’t think —

ROGAN: Dude?

GUPTA: What did they say?

ROGAN: They lied.

GUPTA: What did they say?

ROGAN: They said I was taking horse dewormer.

GUPTA: Yeah, yeah.

ROGAN: First of all, it was prescribed to me by a doctor.

GUPTA: They shouldn’t have said it was —

ROGAN: — a bunch of other medications.

GUPTA: If you got a human pill because there were people that were taking it — the veterinary medication — you’re not, obviously. You got it from a doctor; so that… (sputtering) Shouldn’t be called that. Ivermectin can be a very effective medication for parasitic disease. And as you say, it’s probably, you know, I think, what, a quarter billion people have taken it around the world?

ROGAN: More.

GUPTA: I get that.

ROGAN: Way more.

GUPTA: (sputtering) S-s-so…

ROGAN: Way more. Billions of people have taken it.

GUPTA: C-c-can I just come back to the one…? I want to talk about (sputters)

ROGAN: No, no, no, no, no. You have to answer.

GUPTA: — t-two things on the ledger.

ROGAN: Before we get to that, does it bother you that the news network you work for out-and-out lied —

GUPTA: Well…

ROGAN: — just outright lied about me taking horse dewormer?

GUPTA: They — they — they shouldn’t have said that.

ROGAN: Why did they do that?

GUPTA: I don’t know.

ROGAN: You didn’t ask?

GUPTA: I… I didn’t… (sputters)

ROGAN: You’re the medical guy over there.

GUPTA: I didn’t… I should have asked before coming in and talked to you.

ROGAN: But they did it with such glee.

GUPTA: No. Nooooo.

ROGAN: Yes, they did. I watched.

BUCK: They absolutely did do it with glee. They thought it was hilarious. They loved running the headlines about horse dewormer. I saw it on the screen, Clay, as we were doing the show time and time again. Now isn’t it fascinating? Now, neither you nor I are MDs, but we both have plenty of people in our lives who either inform us because they are doctors or people that call in or email into the show.

But we told this audience. Remember, you can go back and listen; it’s all there. It’s a great time to tell people to check out the Clay and Buck podcast, by the way. It’s all there for you. We were saying whenever this controversy, what was it — back in August, I think — we were saying a few months ago exactly what Dr. Sanjay Gupta is saying which is that it is safe.

They lied. It’s not right for them to call it horse dewormer. Millions and People’s millions of people have taken it around the world, has saved millions of people’s lives or saved them from blindness in many cases. And you look at this, Clay, and realize they have entirely… The narrative weaponized is what this is all about. There are the good people and the bad people.

Trump supporters that don’t take the vaccine, as far as CNN is concerned, are medical insurrectionists. But African-Americans in major cities who have vaccine hesitancy? Well, that’s totally understandable because CNN looks at them as Democrats, of course, and as minorities and so they’ll say, “Well, that’s normal hesitancy for them.” What? It’s because they’re always creating these narratives and chasing them irrespective of what the facts and what actual fairness would do.

CLAY: Yeah, and what I love about this — and this is why I wanted to have Fauci on our program — and, by the way, I would have Dr. Sanjay Gupta on our program as well. We’ve had a lot of doctors on the program. I’m sure you would also, Buck.

BUCK: Yeah.

CLAY: But conversations like these are important because they puncture the existing worldview of cloisterdom, for lack of a better word. (I think I just invented that word.) But everybody has their own island, effectively. And what you saw there, if you’re surrounded entirely by people that reinforce what you already believe, it felt to a large degree like Gupta was stunned to be challenged in that way because there’s so little challenging that goes on now inside of those networks. Buck, you’ve talked about it. You used to be the resident conservative that they would bring out and kind of like slap around on CNN. We don’t even —

BUCK: It’s a little more complicated than that, Clay. First of all, they would get slapped around, part one, which is why they stopped having me on. And part two, they actually brought me on as a counterterrorism expert, really. I used to do terrorism analysis on CNN ’cause I knew that stuff so well having worked at the CTC of the CIA.

They’re like, “Okay, this guy knows his stuff,” and then when Trump came on board they said, “Oh, we need more people who will speak from a conservative point of view,” and when they saw I saw a Trump supporter, then it was all the artillery pieces pointed in my direction.

But here’s what I think Sanjay Gupta — and I’ll tell you, I always say this. Like last night you were on Tucker’s show I was on the 7 p.m. with Jesse Watters and I was talking about CNN, this issue. You know Van Jones. Van Jones is a formidable guy in a debate, and he knows his way around a political strategy; so when he speaks, a lot of CNN audience — even if he’s saying something critical — they’ll tend to listen a little bit.

And he will say things about Democrats that are sometimes critical, right? Sometimes. Usually because they’re not left wing enough is what he’ll criticize them for. Sanjay Gupta has a reputation of being a nice guy, a good guy, and I think he was caught in a moment where it was Sanjay Gupta the MD who knows a lot of people are watching, a lot of people are listening.

Knowing that his network betrayed the American people and then Sanjay Gupta, the chief medical correspondent of CNN, and all his friends — and I’m sure he goes to their weddings and the cocktail parties. He’s like, “I don’t want to throw CNN under the bus.” I think that’s the collision that you saw in his mind happening in real time when he was on Joe Rogan’s show.

CLAY: I also think he was a little bit afraid ’cause the lie. If there’s a lawsuit filed, right? Which who knows what might happen and the chief medical correspondent is on video saying, yeah, we lied like that plays pretty well for a jury, right? In the event that somebody sues and there’s all that, inning there he was probably, even though he’s a doctor, there’s a certain recognition of legal-related maneuvering there.

And also, to be fair, he claimed, “I didn’t see that. ” Are you really gonna tell me…? That’s the part of that I disagree with, right? Are you really gonna tell me that you didn’t see it? I saw it, and I don’t even watch CNN. You didn’t see CNN gleefully saying that Joe Rogan was taking a horse dewormer? It was everywhere. It would be impossible for me to believe that Sanjay Gupta didn’t say it.

It wasn’t like it was one person saying it. It was everyone. And they tried… Did you see that he went on Don Lemon? Maybe we need to play, too, ’cause Don Lemon brought him on, and they tried to clean up this mess ’cause I’ll tell you.

And, by the way, if you want to see a longer version of that clip that we played, I put it out on Twitter that I found and I was watching it last night. Buck, three million people have watched that video that we just played a cut of you for, of Sanjay Gupta trying to talk about the horse deworming and ivermectin and everything else. That’s more people than watch any CNN show.

BUCK: That’s a lot more people than watch CNN’s show.

CLAY: Yes.

BUCK: And it’s also worth noting, though, they will fall back, I think, on “it can be a horse dewormer,” right? It’s really a slimy propaganda trick here. The same way that… I was talking before about how for some people’s pets, if they get a lot of anxiety in the car, in the plane, you can actually give them, at some dosage — I don’t know what it is so don’t do this without talking to your vet — people anxiety medication. But if someone is taking that kind of a drug, they’re not taking cat medicine, medicine you can give to cats.

CLAY: No. It’s designed to try to paint anyone who is not a “we’re all gonna die of covid” alarmist.

BUCK: That’s right.

CLAY: It’s designed to paint them as idiots. It’s designed to paint Trump America as idiots. It’s designed to paint you and me and Buck as idiots.

BUCK: I took ivermectin. So it’s a a little personal for me. I’m a horse dewormer guy?

CLAY: What I’m saying is if you had gotten covid after we started doing this show and said you took ivermectin, CNN probably would have had a headline, “Rush Limbaugh new show host Buck Sexton is a horse deworm, you know, buy-in. You know, they would have come after you.

BUCK: You can tell we’re fired up about this.

BREAK TRANSCRIPT

BUCK: So we have Don Lemon over on CNN — we were just talking about this — and CNN is a propaganda network. They just got exposed pretty handily by Joe Rogan asking a straightforward question of Dr. Sanjay Gupta, the chief medical correspondent, about the horse dewormer/ivermectin mess. Here is Don Lemon trying to clean up the mess.

LEMON: Listen, I think it’s also very important… I know it’s (sputtering) in large part, a tongue-in-cheek interview and, you know, because it’s Joe Rogan and there’s a lot… You’re jockeying back and forth. But he — he did say something about ivermectin that I think wasn’t actually correct about CNN and lying, okay? Ivermectin is a drug that is commonly used as a horse dewormer. So it is not a lie to say that the drug is used as a horse dewormer. (sputtering) I — I — I think that’s important, and it is not approved for covid, correct?

GUPTA: That’s right! That’s correct. It — it — it is not approved for covid. And, you’re right. I mean, the FDA e-e-even put out a statement saying, you know, basically reminding people; it was sort of a strange sort of message from the FDA. It said… “You’re not a horse, you’re not a cow, stop taking this stuff,” is essentially what they said, referring to ivermectin.

BUCK: I mean, Clay, a Ziploc bag —

CLAY: It’s unbelievable.

BUCK: — can be used to smuggle drugs into America in your stomach, but that doesn’t mean you’re sending your kid’s sandwich to school in a drug-smuggling vehicle. You know what I’m saying? Like give me a break.

CLAY: That’s… It is really, really… That is such a transparently false attempt by CNN to cover up this video that is going viral pointing out their lies and the fact that they were caught in lies, and this is where I think it’s so significant. CNN, if they come out of their ivory tower, they don’t want to get into a fight, ’cause they get punched in the face and they ain’t got a good defense.