“Bombshell” Blows Up: Secret Service Denies Hutchinson’s Hearsay

29 Jun 2022

CLAY: Let’s dive right into it, ’cause I am fired up. We discussed a little bit yesterday the January 6th “bombshell witness,” 25-year-old Cassidy Hutchinson, who was working inside the White House with Mark Meadows, the chief of staff at the end of the Trump administration. The January 6th committee has done whatever they can to garner as much attention as they possibly can from a gullible and often complicit news media.

But yesterday’s testimony from Cassidy Hutchinson — which was hearsay about what happened from her perspective based on what she had been told inside of the limo after Donald Trump’s speech on January 6th — set a new low in terms of the willingness of Democrats to go after Donald Trump in this January 6th hearing. Let me explain what I mean by this. What she testified to is hearsay. I understand a lot of people don’t spend a lot of time on legal-related issues, but the general rule is, you are not allowed to testify to something that you were told by someone else that they witnessed.

That is textbook hearsay. So, the January 6th committee, which features a lot of lawyers working on it, made the decision to put this 25-year-old witness on, despite the fact they knew that she was making salacious comments that she herself had not witnessed regarding what Donald Trump may have done inside of that limo. I want to play you this cut because a lot of you are just hearing from the media about these stories and he didn’t even necessarily hear what Cassidy Hutchinson said. This is textbook hearsay. Listen.

Former Trump White House aide Cassidy Hutchinson recounts hearing that Donald Trump tried to force his driver to take him to those marching on the Capitol. “Mr. Trump then used his free hand to lunge towards Bobby,” she said, gesturing to the throat. pic.twitter.com/zJDpO8uRGi

— Mother Jones (@MotherJones) June 28, 2022

CLAY: All of this 100% would be inadmissible in a court of law, Buck. And as if that were not enough, the Secret Service has now said nobody from the January 6th committee reached out to them to ask any of these details in the last 10 days and that both Secret Service agents are ready and prepared and willing to testify to the January 6th committee that what this woman, Cassidy Hutchinson, reported that had occurred and what they had said is not true and as the actual witnesses in that car they are happy to tell their side of the story, which is not what Cassidy Hutchinson said. Buck, this just has blown up even for an incompetent January 6th committee, I think this has destroyed any shred of credibility that they have. This is the worst thing they could have done.

BUCK: Well, this was their best shot, it seems. They were leading up to this is the witness that we didn’t know about before but now with the new bombshell testimony. And you can you can you could tell that they had lined it all up. It reminds me — you remember the morning — this was a great day in fake news history when Elizabeth Warren’s DNA test results came out.

CLAY: Oh, yeah.

BUCK: I was watching CNN in real time, and I actually got into it with their head of PR or whatever online. They were saying, vindication for Elizabeth Warren. It turns out she is .8% Native American, right? And then they realized, “Oh, my gosh. Wait. That’s not gonna work!” Like, they knew what the marching orders were, and it was obviously a catastrophe for them. They knew the marching orders here, “Oh, my gosh. The most riveting testimony ever.” Clay, this is a show trial. It’s not even a trial, right? So, it’s almost wrong to call it that.

CLAY: You couldn’t admit any of this in a trial.

BUCK: The whole thing is absurd. And when it shows you is in the absence of any Republican participation and also the absence of any agreed-upon procedures, exactly what you said, hearsay? Yeah, whatever, they’ll throw it in there. They don’t care. Just process is not justice. You actually have to have a just process, right? You have to actually have some protections in place to get to the truth. This isn’t about getting the truth. This is about propaganda. And, by the way, they all lined up for this one. The reporting, we just —

CLAY: Oh, yeah, we got a cut. I haven’t even heard this yet, but I think everybody’s gonna enjoy it. Greg put this together on our team. Here’s a montage of all the mainstream media breathlessly reacting to that hearsay commentary that you just saw.

BUCK: No which one are we going here? Because the Secret Service here is saying that this is not true. The montage is that it’s not true.

CLAY: Oh, I’m sorry the montage is saying that it’s not true. Sorry. I thought it was them breathlessly reacting. ‘Cause we also got that. Play cut 9.

PIERRE THOMAS: The Secret Service will push back against any allegation of an assault against an agent or President Trump reaching for the steering wheel.

TOM LLAMAS: The Secret Service is telling you that that the lead agent disputes some of Hutchinson’s testimony.

JOY REID: Disputing some of that really dramatic story about Donald Trump trying to lunge forward and take control of The Beast.

PETER ALEXANDER: Prepared to testify under oath that neither man was assaulted and that Mr. Trump never lunged for the steering wheel.

JESSICA SCHNEIDER: The agents involved are prepared to testify under oath that the incident did not occur.

NEAL KATYAL: The Secret Service deny. This one little part, the steering wheel claim.

LAURA JARRETT: The agents would say that the incident itself described there just simply did not happen.

BUCK: That’s a big… Notice even variation there, Clay. Secret Service willing to come out under oath, “This just did not happen.” Essentially, the Secret Service — who, obviously, swore an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution, law enforcement professionals — are willing to say in front of this committee, this never happened. Do you think…? Now we really get down to brass tacks. Do we think they’re going to follow up and you’re going to see the Secret Service agents involved? If they don’t call the Secret Service agent to get their testimony under oath, this thing is even bigger joke and sham than we’ve known it was all along.

CLAY: So, that is the reaction after initial breathless approval of everything that she had said. And I want to play this. But that is a good montage that was put together of people saying, oh, by the way, everything that she testified to essentially is untrue based on the people who were actually witnesses in the vehicle. Here is CNN’s Jamie Gangel — this is cut 11 — saying America and democracy are in debt to Cassidy Hutchinson.

GANGEL: Liz Cheney began her final comments by saying that we are in debt to Cassidy Hutchinson. I think America and democracy is in debt to this young woman.

CLAY: So, I feel bad for her, Buck. And let me explain what I mean by that. She’s 25 years old. She is, I think, trying to be honest to the best of her ability. And yet they just trotted her out there solely for all the headlines to try to make Trump look bad because they know that there’s about 40% of the American public that no matter what you said, if you were like, Donald Trump pulled out a gun and put it to the Secret Service man’s head and said, “If you don’t drive me to the Capitol right now, I’m gonna blow your brains out!” Like, there’s a certain segment of the population, 40% of Americans would believe that that happened, that Trump had a gun in the car, that he put the gun to the Secret Service agent’s head, there’s almost nothing you could say to those 40%, and they had already leaked everything, Buck. And so there’s nothing new, and this was their desperate Hail Mary, and it got intercepted. I don’t even think they even got the pass off.

BUCK: This was the best shot that they could come up with, which tells you a lot. But it’s also a reminder of the ongoing intelligence test here, which is, who will believe whatever crazy thing the fake news will say about the now former by 18 months president of the United States?

CLAY: Yes.

BUCK: Remember back in September of 2020 when they were running with the Donald Trump said Americans who died in war are losers and suckers? That was the big one, oh, right before the election. It was their September Surprise, if you will, instead of an October Surprise. Trump didn’t say that, and it was so obvious. That’s not… There are things that the former president would say that perhaps you and I would say, “Ah, you know, he’s a little salty sometimes.” He’s a fighter. I get it.

Disrespecting our military dead? Nah. That’s not President Trump. Just didn’t happen. But people wanted to believe it, so they believed it. In this case, Clay, lunged for the throat of a Secret Service officer? Donald Trump is gonna try to manhandle a — he’s gonna choke out — a 40-year-old, highly trained Secret Service officer? I know a lot of those guys. I’ve worked around those guys. This just didn’t happen. Trump wouldn’t do it and it just didn’t happen.

CLAY: It also physically doesn’t make sense, Buck. The president rides in the back of the vehicle. In order for him to lunge and grab the steering wheel, first of all, how is he gonna steer from the back of the vehicle? And to jump all the way from the back of the vehicle to the front of the vehicle and take control of the steering wheel? It just doesn’t even physically make sense. And again, to your point, we’re not talking about the world’s greatest, most athletic man. We’re talking about a 75-year-old guy who’s gonna leap from the back of a vehicle to the front, grab a wheel, and then, what, like, steer it? He doesn’t still control the pedals, right? It’s just nonsensical.

BUCK: It goes back to your initial point. We don’t even have to… You know, hearsay as the legal term. If you’re serious here, meaning that the Democrats are serious about this story being true, of course you go with an eyewitness. Why do they go with a 25-year-old executive assistant or whatever who wasn’t even there? Like, think about the mentality all these months, think of the millions of taxpayer dollars that are being spent on the congressional salaries —

CLAY: This is what fires me up, Buck. All the people that know better on the hearsay front that would say, this is really crappy, not very reliable.

BUCK: Oh, but they don’t care. The point is when it comes to Trump, whether you’re a journalist, a lawyer, an intelligence officer, whatever, all of your ethics are supposed to be thrown out the window because stopping and now just defaming. Stopping Trump is all that matters.

CLAY: Yeah.

BUCK: And they can’t get out of that mentality, and what we see here is now any person… They thought this was gonna force everyone to go, “Oh, gosh. Donald Trump, he’s so scary. The nuclear codes,” and, remember, the president who didn’t start a war and didn’t watch as Europe had its biggest war since World War II, he’s the big threat? I don’t think so, folks.

CLAY: Also, the president — and this is a big point in his favor — that they said was gonna be a dictator? There was never a time in most of our lives where a president could have taken more power than in the early days after covid. If you were truly dictatorial in your belief scheme, there has never been, I don’t believe, in my life, a time — maybe right after 9/11 — when a president had more opportunity to take complete and total control.

Trump deferred to mayors, to governors, to executives in all different parts of the country. In fact, you can argue, if anything, that his federal control was too light because it led to some Draconian policies being implemented by officials in other states. And so this… I mean, we need to open up phone lines, too, because I think this is just such a ridiculous thing that they did. And I’m curious how many people in media will actually even call out the committee —

BUCK: My favorites, though, are the quoted Republicans. There are still this core of these Never Trumpers out there who this was their moment of vindication yesterday, Clay. And now the Secret Service has come out and say, “No, it didn’t happen. We’ll swear to the fact this didn’t happen.”

CLAY: And I, as a lawyer, almost want people that are lawyers that on this committee held to account by their bar association, like, how in the world did you ever put this witness up to tell her story?

BUCK: You know even better than me the bar association is basically like run by the Communist Manifesto now.

CLAY: I know. Unfortunately. I’m a member of two. But yes, there are a — from a legal perspective what they did in this show trial was 100 billion percent indefensible, also untrue. And anyone out there who is in the media that helped to propagate these lies — and, Buck, you know, we were on the air, I was going through Twitter, and people were gleefully reacting to this, and it’s all a lie based on people who were actually there and witnesses.

And again, the January 6th committee, according to the Secret Service, did not even reach out in the last 10 days before they allowed this bombshell witness to testify to corroborate her comments in any way, her testimony that she heard from someone else who was there what happened, direct and clear and present hearsay. Be a good law exam question in the years ahead.

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Maybe Fauci isn’t just evil. It’s possible he’s totally nuts too. A tiny tyrant mad scientist. https://t.co/muHEjJjt4A

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Not the kind of guy to brag or draw attention to myself @BuckSexton, but the lady at the table next to us tonight said my two boys were fabulously well behaved & I don’t think she had any idea who I was or that we talked about kid behavior at restaurants on @clayandbuck today.

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Should we banish neckties as a business/formal wear standard for men in suits?

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Trump Responds to Dems’ Latest Jan. 6 Lies

28 Jun 2022

CLAY: We want to give you the latest on January 6th as the obsession continues with the former president of the United States. The Wall Street Journal just put out an alert talking about Cassidy Hutchinson and her testimony. We, of course, are live during this testimony. And she is “recounting a dramatic altercation,” I’m reading from the Wall Street Journal, “that took place in the president’s limousine after his Secret Service detail refused to drive him to the Capitol.”

Trump lunged at the steering wheel, said, “I’m the F-ing president, take me to the Capitol now,” and his agent said, “Sir, we have to go back to the West Wing.” Now, she also says President Trump was mad when he was told that there was not fraud and threw his lunch plate against the walls. She helped clean that up. She is testifying at least in regards to the limousine based on hearsay someone else told her what exactly was said there. So just so you are aware, that is the January 6th details from today’s testimony.

BREAK TRANSCRIPT

CLAY: Trump is responding on TRUTH Social. He says, “Never complained about the crowd. It was massive. I didn’t want to request we make room with people for guns to watch my speech. Who would ever want that? Not me. Besides, no guns found or brought into the Capitol building. Where were all these guns? Sadly, a gun was used on Ashli Babbitt with no price to pay against the person who used it.”

He also says, “I hardly know who this person, Cassidy Hutchinson, is, other than I heard very negative things about her (a total phony and ‘leaker’), and when she requested to go with certain others of the team to Florida after my having served a full term in office, I personally turned her request down. Why did she want to go with us if she felt we were so terrible? I understand that she was very upset and angry that I didn’t want her to go, or be a member of the team. She is bad news!”

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C&B Speak Truth… on Jackets, Ties, Weddings and Kids in Restaurants

28 Jun 2022

BUCK: The G7. You saw that photo right, Clay, where it’s all these world leaders? None of them had a tie on, and this is where I get to… Maybe I’m gonna start a little something here. I’m just gonna say it. I’m anti-tie, and I know that some people think that this is blasphemy, but I don’t know why we still feel compelled — and I just want to make my case here. I don’t even know where you come down on this, so maybe you agree with me.

But the notion that we should still be wearing them, because a bunch of Croatian mercenaries in the service of Louis XIV in I think it was the seventeenth century wore a little piece of cloth around their neck and then the fancy French fashionistas said, “This looks cool. We’re gonna start doing this,” I don’t think we have to keep going with this anymore. And the people that know fashion and stuff are gonna say, “Buck, this is why you wear baggy T-shirts all the time.” Fine. But they’re not comfortable, they don’t really make any sense, and we don’t have a tie sponsor, so I’m proud to say — or I’m comfortable saying — I think the necktie needs to go bye-bye.

CLAY: I don’t disagree with that at all, actually, and I’ve been anti even wearing jackets a lot when it’s not cold, and this is maybe the Southerner in me. Like, having to put on a jacket when it’s 98 degrees makes no sense. So when I practiced law I had a suit coat with a tie in the event that I had to go in court so I could put it on if there’s a hearing or whatever. But I would show up like most lawyers would in, like, a button-down and khaki pants or whatever. And I really… I’m in agreement.

As I sit and talk to you right now, you know — people obviously in the theater of the mind here have no clue — what do I wear 99% of the time? T-shirt, shorts, flip-flops. Even when you see me behind the scenes here on Fox News, if I’m doing it from my home cam, I’ve got a jacket and a button-down on and then I’ve got shorts on. Tomorrow morning, when you see me on Fox & Friends from down here in Florida — spoiler alert — I’m gonna have on a jacket, a shirt, and shorts and flip-flops. Nobody will even know. But if you saw me from behind that’s what it looks like.

BUCK: I just think it’s important we speak the truth, and the truth is this notion, first of all, of a three-piece suit is not comfortable. I don’t care who you are, they’re not that comfortable. Suit jackets aren’t. But I understand, for business purposes and everything else, presentation matters. Okay. I’m willing to deal with the suit. But a tie? It’s like a strangulation device. This makes no sense. They’re not comfortable. For weddings, it’s the way I feel about black shoes. For weddings and funerals, fine.

CLAY: The only reason I’ll defend a tie — I will say this — is men have almost no other way to distinguish ourselves, right? ‘Cause the average guy you wear, like, a white shirt, a dark I can’t recollect and, like, whatever, dark pants. Women have all sorts of clothes that they can wear. The tie is maybe the only thing that can provide a little bit of flavor, right? You get the different color tie, the fun tie.

BUCK: Clay wants to share his flava!

CLAY: I’m not in favor of them. I’m just saying, there’s a reason why, when you go to a wedding, for instance, every man is wearing the exact same outfit, and we all look a little bit ridiculous. Now, obviously that’s because in general we don’t matter. Weddings, I would say are for women more than men. I’m probably just throwing myself into a —

BUCK: Clay ‘splaining like a madman today.

CLAY: I know. Women like weddings more than men. Just gonna point it out. And for everybody out there, by the way, who is listening right now, as a Southern man, if you have a fall wedding, I think that you hate everything that is good about America because the best thing about America is college football, and there’s not a man alive who listens to this show is in the South that is in favor of having to spend a Saturday going to watch a wedding — it doesn’t matter who’s getting married — over getting to watch college football games all day.

BUCK: Wow.

CLAY: Do you even know this?

BUCK: I thought I was —

CLAY: As a New Yorker?

BUCK: We don’t watch college football in New York.

CLAY: Did you even know that the fall wedding is like the third rail for a lot of people in the South, that you can’t even have a fall wedding because college football is so big?

BUCK: Learning something new every day.

CLAY: Oh. It is a monster faux pas. Now, I know everything got backed up because of covid and every week for like the next 10 years is taken now and somebody out there is like, “It’s the only time we could get married in the certain place here.”

BUCK: What happens in the Northeast is we only get certain long weekends that are travel weekends.

CLAY: Yes.

BUCK: And a lot of people like to have the wedding Memorial Day weekend, like to have the wedding Labor Day weekend, Fourth of July weekend. That’s a big ask, folks. That’s a big… I mean, if it’s immediate family, of course they gotta be there. But if I’m the date and it’s really the Second Cousin Sally Beth or something who’s having the wedding, am I really supposed to give up my long weekend for this? I mean, that’s rough. I’m just saying it.

CLAY: You’ll appreciate this. I went to a fall wedding once, and I was like, “How in the world did you pick this fall wedding?” and I was like, “She’s pregnant, right?” and he was like, “Yeah, she’s pregnant.” So, you have to avoid the shotgun wedding in the South, and you have to avoid the fall wedding, but if you have to choose between the two, you go fall wedding sometimes.

BUCK: So, that was one little place where I thought we might… I’ll put out a poll. I’m wondering if people think I’m crazy. I’m an evangelist for comfortable feet and no necktie.

CLAY: Also, anti-basically people talking on their phones. (laughing) I saw your angry tweets about FaceTiming.

BUCK: Oh, I am leading an anti-phone rudeness revolution. I am a one-man wrecking crew. I lose my mind, and I don’t care. I don’t know what it is with people, but it’s gotten worse in the last couple years, I think, ’cause everyone’s, “Oh, well, FaceTime! I FaceTime for work.” It’s all about video. If you are in a public place on FaceTime with speakerphone on, you are a barbarian who is destroying our civilization.

CLAY: Do you FaceTime guy friends of yours?

BUCK: Do I what?

CLAY: Do you FaceTime guy friends of yours?

BUCK: No!

CLAY: I’m just curious. You should see the younger generation.

BUCK: Trick question.

CLAY: No, no, no. I understand if you’re dating a girl and, like, you want to see her and you want to FaceTime with her, but I am seeing increasingly like younger guys, instead of, like, texting or calling a friend, they will FaceTime each other and just like talk to each other on FaceTime.

BUCK: I have not seen that. That sounds —

CLAY: Oh, it’s monstrously big. I guarantee you there’s a lot of dads out there nodding along. A lot of teenagers, a lot young age dudes, they FaceTime instead of calling.

BUCK: And I’m just gonna say it, I don’t know what it is, and I’m telling you hoping to become a parent myself over the next couple years. I don’t know what it is, but somewhere along the line, some parent decided that bringing the iPad for the kids to the restaurant… All right, you want to do that, that’s fair play, fair play. There’s a thing they’ve made called headphones and they belong on the child’s ears or in their ears at the restaurant. I do not want to hear Tickle Me Elmo while I am eating my filet mignon.

CLAY: Pull this clip, because I will tell you as a parent who may plan that your kids are gonna be great at the table, there is an awful lot of scramble. “Here, just take the phone, take the iPad, and watch a video,” and it is a saving grace. So, I want to pull that clip, Ali, I want you to save this for Buck as dad, somebody is going to see Buck as dad, he’s gonna be out, he’s gonna have, like, eight kids, they’re all gonna have iPads going simultaneously, and he’s not even gonna be able to hear it.

BUCK: Civilization comes at a price, Clay. Freedom isn’t free, my friend, all right? And that includes iPad usage.

CLAY: The chaos that you are used to once you become a parent in terms of noise, in terms of all the zaniness and, like, you have like a Zen to it where you don’t even hear it the same ways you did before you had kids. And, by the way, Ali is saying about this, “Couldn’t you just put televisions at receptions?” This is also a big battle ’cause some brides don’t want their big day to be distracted by a football game. Again, no fall weddings. Just don’t do it. Just don’t do it.

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CLAY: I believe that anyone who is getting their 6-month-old to 5-year-old the covid shot is so overcome with anxiety that they haven’t looked at the actual data or science. And this is scary to me: We got Sesame Street characters — this is 100% real; this is not made up — Elmo, the Sesame Street character, went to get his covid shot. This is what they played on Sesame Street. Listen.

Elmo got the COVID vaccine today, just like Elmo’s mommy and daddy! Elmo’s daddy had a lot of questions, but Elmo’s doctor said the vaccine would help keep Elmo healthy, and all of Elmo’s friends and family too! #CaringForEachOther https://t.co/do2AcvCfMg

— Elmo (@elmo) June 28, 2022

BUCK: This is puppet propaganda. This is crazy!

CLAY: Does this disgust you as much as it does me?

BUCK: Yeah, of course. First of all, the sound of Elmo’s voice to an adult —

CLAY: (laughing)

BUCK: — to bring this up again, makes me want to jump through a plate glass window. Okay, start with that.

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28 Jun 2022

BUCK: CNN ratings down, what was it, Clay, 40%, is that right, second quarter?

Cable News 2nd quarter ratings — viewers
Total day
Fox 1.45 million viewers, up 21%
MSNBC 684,000 viewers, down 20%
CNN 521,000 viewers, down 21%
Prime
Fox: 2,3 million viewers, up 4%
MSNBC 1.13 million viewers, down 23%
CNN 670,000 viewerse, down 27%

— Joe Flint (@JBFlint) June 28, 2022

CLAY: Yes. I’m just reading from it. During the commercial break I was telling Buck. Let me make sure — Joe Flint, who I believe is at the Wall Street Journal. So he is sharing some of these numbers. Trump was the golden goose for MSNBC and for CNN. Prime-time viewership in the second quarter, CNN down 31% over last year, MSNBC down 40%. Fox News down just 2%. That’s 25- to 54-year-olds. The reason why I mention that is you lose 40% of your audience in anything, you’re not having a good time.

More second quarter cable news ratings. 25-54 demo.
Total day
Fox News down 11% in 25-54
CNN down 31%
MSNBC down 34%
Prime time
Fox News down 2% in 25-54
CNN down 31%
MSNBC down 40%

— Joe Flint (@JBFlint) June 28, 2022

BUCK: People start getting fired, which has already happened over at CNN. Look, everything that I’ve been saying for… We have different CNN experiences, right? I left because I couldn’t stand the place anymore and thought that it had become just a disgrace. Even to cable news, it was a disgrace, never mind to journalism, and obviously you a moment there, well known, and got banned. Like I said, it’s like being banned from North Korea.

It’s a badge of honor to be banned from CNN. But when we said that they had effectively destroyed whatever credibility they had as a news-gathering organization under Jeff Zucker’s time, that was the truth. That’s why Jeff Zucker got fired. And when I told everybody that they’re bad people that you cannot trust who are running that place and some of the biggest-name talent, that was the truth. They’re not good people. Look at what’s happened there.

Clay and Buck

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